Remember he had a restricted pre season due to a knee operation last year. I don't think he had much left in the tank by the end of the season.
His tackling was terrific for such a tall player. Crashing packs takes a lot out of you physically. One awkward landing and you can be restricted in your movement. His accurate kicking for goal and the number of goals kicked for a first season was impressive. A tall forward relies on the ball being delivered to them. It takes some time to get a good connection, particularlywith a lot of new forwards in the team.
I see a lot of upside for him this year.
He was also quite good as a pinch hit ruckman, something we haven't had for a while.
Yeah I agonised about whether to put him in, and as I said i think it’s harsh, it’s just I think key FWD is the one position we haven’t quite nailed down. he’s in there more as a ‘need to make it his own’.
Everyone but Ward and CJ (Ward out of contract this year and CJ 2027) has their contract written into the body of their analysis but I agree it’s a fair point it should probably more explicit at the top!
I love what you bring to HI Nat… Thankyou! Butler’s carrot is claiming Luke Breust’s position in 2026 who surely retires at year’s end and whilst huge boots to fill the opportunity exists. Other than fitness, I don’t know how anyone improves playing mostly in the VFL. It is a different game, a hybrid team with constant changes and sometimes shitty surfaces. Has CJ ever played a good game in the 2’s???? If Ward is to make it he needs a string of games in the AFL which won’t happen unless injuries occur. His 2026 chances may rest on whether Worps leaves as a free agent (I hope not)! Thoughts???
Firstly, thankyou! It’s a privilege being involved and i do know how lucky i am.
Secondly - all are completely fair points. Butler is a tough one - invested good draft capital and obviously the leg was something no one can control, but a very fair point r.e Breust retiring.
Yep Worpel is a very interesting watch I believe most Hawthorn fans have had that weird inkling Geelong will come knocking given where he is from. I hope he stays - he has turned his career around significantly and is still definitely in our best 7-8 players. I’m hoping personally McKenzie turns into our next A Level mid - i think his skill set is more advanced than Ward at this stage
I totally agree about Chol. Finals is where you find out about players. He was really awful. And as you point out Ward's first final was first class but I agree he never seems to have found the right position (and on the same finals point both Morrison and Macginess were very good for us so I have to stop bagging them).
You are wrong about the draft for 2025 - we don't have two first rounders, only one - we have Carltons but we traded ours to West Coast for Barrass.
apologies, misread that. We can actually trade two years in advance at this draft for the first time so we we could have 3 first round draft picks to trade if we got really keen.
Interesting article Nat, and you're probably right that these players will be feeling twitchy. The main thing for me is that each has shown that they are too good for VFL, which would suggest that should they be denied opportunity at senior level in 2025, they will likely be in demand by other clubs at season's end.
Ward has AFL attributes - he is a neat kick, has outstanding endurance and is an effective tackler. His problem is that he is an inside midfielder only. The challenge for the match committee is to find a way where his strengths can be utilized to enhance our midfield group. We blew our pick 6 in 2020 with Denver and a similar outcome with pick 7 in 2021 would mean two terrific opportunities to really shift the quality of our list have been wasted. No matter how well we may think we're currently placed, that will set us back.
Reeves battled in 2024 with a serious back injury that limited his pre-season and severely restricted his ability to train. Lloyd was outstanding last season, but did fade as the season wore on (not surprising as 2024 was his first season carrying the ruck load solo). It wouldn't take too much improvement (6 touches and a mark a game) to see Ned challenging Lloyd, which is exactly what we want. If nothing else, Ned is great back up and gives us an opportunity to manage Meeky over the 2025 season.
While Ginnivan was good in 2024, his pre-season has been impacted by an ongoing adductor injury. O'Sullivan was delisted and Punky is in his final season, thus Butler fills an important spot on the list and only needs to play well in the VFL to earn a contract extension.
CJ is a wild card for season 2025, and whole heartedly agree that the wing is his position. He offers so much more than Morrison and if he can put together a run of games, given his pre-season, there's no reason why he can't cement a spot on the wing.
Like you Nat, I'm a Hustwaite fan, but there's such a logjam for that role, it's hard to see him getting an opportunity unless there's a spate of injuries. He'd be ideal for a side like Collingwood, GWS or West Coast.
Last season, Brisbane quite likely had players such as Lohman, Lester, Ah Chee and Answerth in similar positions to those on your list, yet all played in the premiership team and in the case of Lester, Lohman and Ah Chee were instrumental across the season to the Lions' success.
I remember that, when we acquired Mabior Chol and Massimo D'Ambrosio, that I commented that what I'd seen of them prior was that they had all the tools but no toolbox.
Sammy has given them a gold-plated toolbox and they were dominant, for the most part, during the home and way fixture. Chol dropped off a cliff in finals, but D'Ambrosio did not.
I'll be looking for them to continue to play well - and for Chol to keep his game up for finals. Could be a difference.
Mabior on this list??? 🤣 Didn't he lead the goal kicking last year?
You need a strong group of about 30 to really compete through to the end of September
23 plus 7 or 8 who can step in and play a role should the need arise - much like Ward did in last year's final. It's the strength of that near fringe group that determines how far you will go.
Which of these "older guys" don't make that list?
Butler and Mitchell are probably the two for me at this point.
Well done Nat!
Great analysis.
Agree with all but Chol.
Remember he had a restricted pre season due to a knee operation last year. I don't think he had much left in the tank by the end of the season.
His tackling was terrific for such a tall player. Crashing packs takes a lot out of you physically. One awkward landing and you can be restricted in your movement. His accurate kicking for goal and the number of goals kicked for a first season was impressive. A tall forward relies on the ball being delivered to them. It takes some time to get a good connection, particularlywith a lot of new forwards in the team.
I see a lot of upside for him this year.
He was also quite good as a pinch hit ruckman, something we haven't had for a while.
Yeah I agonised about whether to put him in, and as I said i think it’s harsh, it’s just I think key FWD is the one position we haven’t quite nailed down. he’s in there more as a ‘need to make it his own’.
I hope Chol has a great year, clunks his marks and kicks 40-50 goals. We would all be rapt. He also looks to be very popular with his teammates.
Be good to add their contract situation to this analysis. If they can’t make it here it would be good to get something for them when they leave.
Everyone but Ward and CJ (Ward out of contract this year and CJ 2027) has their contract written into the body of their analysis but I agree it’s a fair point it should probably more explicit at the top!
I love what you bring to HI Nat… Thankyou! Butler’s carrot is claiming Luke Breust’s position in 2026 who surely retires at year’s end and whilst huge boots to fill the opportunity exists. Other than fitness, I don’t know how anyone improves playing mostly in the VFL. It is a different game, a hybrid team with constant changes and sometimes shitty surfaces. Has CJ ever played a good game in the 2’s???? If Ward is to make it he needs a string of games in the AFL which won’t happen unless injuries occur. His 2026 chances may rest on whether Worps leaves as a free agent (I hope not)! Thoughts???
Firstly, thankyou! It’s a privilege being involved and i do know how lucky i am.
Secondly - all are completely fair points. Butler is a tough one - invested good draft capital and obviously the leg was something no one can control, but a very fair point r.e Breust retiring.
Yep Worpel is a very interesting watch I believe most Hawthorn fans have had that weird inkling Geelong will come knocking given where he is from. I hope he stays - he has turned his career around significantly and is still definitely in our best 7-8 players. I’m hoping personally McKenzie turns into our next A Level mid - i think his skill set is more advanced than Ward at this stage
I totally agree about Chol. Finals is where you find out about players. He was really awful. And as you point out Ward's first final was first class but I agree he never seems to have found the right position (and on the same finals point both Morrison and Macginess were very good for us so I have to stop bagging them).
You are wrong about the draft for 2025 - we don't have two first rounders, only one - we have Carltons but we traded ours to West Coast for Barrass.
I said we have Carlton’s 2025 and our own 2026 - we can trade it as a future pick
apologies, misread that. We can actually trade two years in advance at this draft for the first time so we we could have 3 first round draft picks to trade if we got really keen.
Interesting article Nat, and you're probably right that these players will be feeling twitchy. The main thing for me is that each has shown that they are too good for VFL, which would suggest that should they be denied opportunity at senior level in 2025, they will likely be in demand by other clubs at season's end.
Ward has AFL attributes - he is a neat kick, has outstanding endurance and is an effective tackler. His problem is that he is an inside midfielder only. The challenge for the match committee is to find a way where his strengths can be utilized to enhance our midfield group. We blew our pick 6 in 2020 with Denver and a similar outcome with pick 7 in 2021 would mean two terrific opportunities to really shift the quality of our list have been wasted. No matter how well we may think we're currently placed, that will set us back.
Reeves battled in 2024 with a serious back injury that limited his pre-season and severely restricted his ability to train. Lloyd was outstanding last season, but did fade as the season wore on (not surprising as 2024 was his first season carrying the ruck load solo). It wouldn't take too much improvement (6 touches and a mark a game) to see Ned challenging Lloyd, which is exactly what we want. If nothing else, Ned is great back up and gives us an opportunity to manage Meeky over the 2025 season.
While Ginnivan was good in 2024, his pre-season has been impacted by an ongoing adductor injury. O'Sullivan was delisted and Punky is in his final season, thus Butler fills an important spot on the list and only needs to play well in the VFL to earn a contract extension.
CJ is a wild card for season 2025, and whole heartedly agree that the wing is his position. He offers so much more than Morrison and if he can put together a run of games, given his pre-season, there's no reason why he can't cement a spot on the wing.
Like you Nat, I'm a Hustwaite fan, but there's such a logjam for that role, it's hard to see him getting an opportunity unless there's a spate of injuries. He'd be ideal for a side like Collingwood, GWS or West Coast.
Last season, Brisbane quite likely had players such as Lohman, Lester, Ah Chee and Answerth in similar positions to those on your list, yet all played in the premiership team and in the case of Lester, Lohman and Ah Chee were instrumental across the season to the Lions' success.
Cheers and thanks for the article.
Great post, Nat!
I remember that, when we acquired Mabior Chol and Massimo D'Ambrosio, that I commented that what I'd seen of them prior was that they had all the tools but no toolbox.
Sammy has given them a gold-plated toolbox and they were dominant, for the most part, during the home and way fixture. Chol dropped off a cliff in finals, but D'Ambrosio did not.
I'll be looking for them to continue to play well - and for Chol to keep his game up for finals. Could be a difference.
Mabior on this list??? 🤣 Didn't he lead the goal kicking last year?
You need a strong group of about 30 to really compete through to the end of September
23 plus 7 or 8 who can step in and play a role should the need arise - much like Ward did in last year's final. It's the strength of that near fringe group that determines how far you will go.
Which of these "older guys" don't make that list?
Butler and Mitchell are probably the two for me at this point.